What needs to be done to make seasteading investment worthy


This is a continuation of the what needs to be done to make seasteading investment worthy topic from the old forum system.

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Marine Concrete Basics
(Wilfried Ellmer) #2

Make seasteading investment worthy

What we need to do (stop doing) so that the people that just invested 7,2 Billion USD into that – stop investing in “sandbank building” and start to see SEASTEADING as a better “investment option”… (what it is).
– change the way we talk
– change the way we are percieved
– communicate business efficient

Get a foothold in ocean business development…

Focus on Oceanic Business Development

Marine business has “Road to Seasteading” written all over its development horizon.

The evolutionary principle: The “next big” that draws huge investment streams will be something that is just ONE step away from what exists already today.

It it will be something that a business man strongly rooted in todays business can imagine as doable.

Focus shift from “building weired communities” to enable ocean colonization and oceanic business. ( http://concretesubmarine.activeboard.com/t58921987/sustainability-population-growth-consumption-growth-ocean-co/ ) a base condition for human survival.

A seastead is BUSINESS, it is CLUSTER, and it is NETWORK.

– If there is no business to do, there is no base for a town, no base for a settlement, no point to have a “permanent dwelling” of any kind.
– No town on earth is just doing one thing it is always a “cluster of things” towns and settlements are doing.
– Venice was a network of marine merchants owning 3600 ships.


How doing clusters of things changes business dynamics:

Due to its connection to ships mobility and oceanic trade a seastead (equally as Venice) has a natural business in banking – speak internet banking, bitcoin, offshore solutions.


A seastead is by nature a power broker (like Venice) commited to the core value of freedom:


BOTTLENECK, business opportunity

Seasteading is about removing the technology bottleneck that held ancient marine cultures back to develop permanent dwellings on the oceans earlier…http://concretesubmarine.activeboard.com/t59290740/seasteading-ocean-colonization-technology-bottleneck/
It is not about politics, it is about business, it is about technology, and unique development opportunities comming up the first time in human history.

Seasteading…megayachts, bitcoin, offshoring, 

Cluster investment worthy developments around Seasteading…megayachts, bitcoin, offshoring, world citicenship,


  Why do ‘Seasteaders’ love Bitcoin?

Ariella Brown (@AriellaBrown) | Published on May 24, 2013 at 10:52 GMT

Bitcoin represents more than a digital currency. For many adopters, it is a means of breaking free of government and financial institutions’ control over money.

The Seasteading Institute shares those ideals. Just as libertarians in the Bitcoin community see the currency as a way to get free of fiat and avoid the financial transaction roadblocks erected at national boundaries or through credit regulations, seasteaders put their hope into the idea of new, independent cities as a way to escape the stranglehold of government systems.

Since April 2009, the Seasteading Institute has been working toward the goal of bringing about permanent, innovative communities that float at sea. The organization is headed by prominent libertarians, including Patri Friedman, the son of political theorist David Friedman and grandson of economist Milton Friedman.

Friedman stepped down as chief executive of the institute in early 2012, though he retains the position of chairman.

While creating a viable, floating city would cost billions of dollars, Friedman has insisted that funding is not the real obstacle to bringing the project to life.

“The challenge is getting people to see that this can be a route to political reform,” he said.

The Seasteading Institute lays out its goals like this:

The Seasteading Institute wishes to enable the creation of ocean city-states in order to advance humanity through innovative startup governments. We believe that competition in government will lead to better government for the whole planet. Governments are ultimately the stewards of institutions, which are more or less the “rules of the game.” Looking around the world, it is easy to see that some countries have better rules than others. Good or bad, however, rules can become entrenched in the absence of competition from new market entrants. Currently no new governments can peacefully enter the “governance market,” but with seasteading, experimentation with new rules is possible.

PayPal cofounder Peter Thiel echoed that idea in an article in a Details magazine article titled, “The Billionaire King of Techtopia.”

Thiel has noted, “When you start a company, true freedom is at the beginning of things.” He also draws a parallel to the inception of the US government.

“The United States Constitution had things you could do at the beginning that you couldn’t do later,” he said. What he seeks to explore is a way to begin fresh, with all the possibilities that suggests.

Thiel has supported The Seasteading Institute since its beginning. In 2008, he donated $500,000, the same amounted he put into Facebook in 2004. Subsequent donations have brought his total contribution to around $1.25 million.

The Seasteading Institute’s philosophy dovetails with the views Thiel espoused in an April 2009 essay for the Cato Institute, “The Education of a Liberatarian.” In that piece, he declares that libertarians must get beyond restrictive government systems by finding a place of their own:

“The critical question then becomes one of means, of how to escape not via politics but beyond it. Because there are no truly free places left in our world, I suspect that the mode for escape must involve some sort of new and hitherto untried process that leads us to some undiscovered country; and for this reason I have focused my efforts on new technologies that may create a new space for freedom.”

Thiel identifies three possible spaces in which to find that freedom: cyberspace, outer space and the seas. He explains his support for seasteading this way: “From my vantage point, the technology involved is more tentative than the internet, but much more realistic than space travel … It is a realistic risk, and for this reason I eagerly support this initiative.”

Thiel is also betting on the success of Bitcoin, as his Founders Fund has invested in the Bitcoin merchant services firm BitPay. In fact, Bitcoin might in fact be the realization of what Thiel once envisioned for PayPal.

Though we think of PayPal today as just another part of the standard payment system, like Visa or MasterCard, Thiel’s early goals were far more radical and ambitious.

As the Details article revealed, PayPal was intended to serve “the techno-cool libertarian ideal: a way of emancipating money from government’s monopolistic clutches.” That ideal was even reflected in early company-issued shirts, which bore the legend, “THE NEW WORLD CURRENCY.”

Ken Howery, one of PayPal’s co-founders, explained that Thiel was convinced that “people should be able to store their money in any currency they wanted, without fear of governments devaluing it.” While PayPal has gone on to great success as a company, it’s fallen far short of those libertarian ideals.

Bitcoin, however, has awakened new hope for the ultimate solution to a government-free currency … which is one of the concerns of Seasteaders. One policy recommended by the Seasteading Mission Statement addresses the monetary system, emphasizing — for example — that the “Gold Standard would be set back in place.”

The proposed policy stresses it is not gold per se that is essential — what’s needed is for the monetary system to be determined by the marketplace rather by a governing authority: “So as libertarians, we really shouldn’t advocate a gold standard as it might imply that we think the government should manage it. For a truly free market, it is the marketplace that should decide on what will be used as money. Most likely, I would bet my fiat money that the market would choose gold again.”

For many today, though, the answer is to be found not in gold but in “Gold 2.0, as Bitcoin as been dubbed. A recent Reason article explained that, while people have in the past looked to gold as a shelter from inflation and currency crashes, “the high-tech Bitcoin cryptocurrency recently stepped in to fill that role in a more portable way.”

Mike Caldwell, the creator of Casascius Coins put it this way:

“Bitcoin is two things. It’s a community, and it’s a technology … because Bitcoin is just today’s embodiment of the idea that we now have the technology to democratize money.”

In the same way, seasteaders seek to harness community and technology to establish a new type of civilization, one where Bitcoin could serve as a currency not tied to any nation and allowing free transactions among all.

Incidentally, The Seasteading Institute does accept Bitcoin donations. (It also notes, however, that the US government does not recognize these as tax-deductible contributions.”)

Reduce the heat of controversial political discussion

– solve the media dilemma – as long as seasteading lives a life as “media spectacle” having the heat high up and engage in political discussion is the “core of the venture”…only controversial things bring up media ratings.
– Politics is bad for business. Draw investor money requires calm business ambient taking no side, keeping politics out.

Let investors know that:

– you understand business in general
– you understand the process
– you understand the handling
– you have figured out a feasible way to reach the goal
– you know where the reefs are that need to be steered free of
– you are the right resource to execute the plan

If no investor is calling allow yourself the question – where are my weak points – what do i need to improve, why investors are not comfortable putting money into that project.

Get a foothold in ocean colonization:


The Captain Nemo Lifestyle:


Why oceanic business is the next big thing to come:


Ocean sphere fish farming:


Ocean colonization gallery:


Big things have small beginnings ocean colonization transition, potential:


Sustainability on Planet Earth only the oceans can safe us:


Free spirited oceanic lifestyle global mobility:


Seasteading as “investor centric frontier development venture”

Seasteading is about investors, forming an investor consortium, developing a frontier…

Understand the Asian Sand War is understanding floating real estate

The Asian Sandwar is about the political and business implications of landfill and creating new terrain from the ocean in a slow creeping almost imperceptible but powerful evolutionary process. it helps to understand on a practical example where seasteading and floating real estate is heading

“investor conversation” – be prepared to have it…

We need to come to the phase 1 investor conversation, it is already clear that convincing can not be done on paper, it must be done with floating structures. What matters is “the size of the point made” avoid “pointless” floating ventures…

…a serious developer always has a “project pipeline”…

The principle of massive parallel development represented in a “project pipeline” – what you go for, is try fast, learn fast, fail cheap, try again and again and again, “get systematic in your development approach”… …

…contest: make most seasteading of USD 100.000…let’s see what you come up with…

Instead of trying to invent seasteading in a “single controversal project” have a “dozend projects” with USD 100.000 each – then document the result of each group, select the best according to the results in round 1 and fund USD 300.000 to the winners to go for round 2 – repeate and scale up until the final solution is on the table. Instead of “arbitrary hand pic” a engineering firm develop a merit based developer pool.

The “big five” of ocean colonization : 


Seasteading task: Engage the big five…

investor proposal list

Politics - less is more

“We don’t sit on a cruise ship and think to ourselves, `Well, what kind of system of governance do they have? Do they have a constitution? Are they electing selectmen? Do they have a governor?’ It’s a private company that runs that cruise ship, and I think that’s part of the reason that we enjoy being on board.”

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(Bob LLewellyn) #3

There are a dozen answers to that question depending on the seastead. A floating island would be appealing to movie stars and other big money people that want to get away to someplace special. But I am more focused on learning to live at sea. Fish farms, algae plantations, breading and seeding shrimp all of which is very marketable right now. In addition, we could have floating hydroponic gardens for our fresh vegetable market. There are a lot of boaters that would love to have some facilities available outside any country. Gambling and prostitution would be legal in a libertarian community, that will draw the boaters and other libertarians.

I am more interested in a working kind of town vs another resort. That is why I think the shallow ocean is a better way to start. Plenty of almost free energy can run desalinization plants so we could supply fresh water to the boaters all at a price. We could get a fuel barge and dock it alongside our platforms, sell tax free fuel.

This shallow ocean village would cost much less to build so we can just keep adding on. The shallow sea concept could easily support a population of 50 thousand and more. This is a business begging to happen. I hear this voice screaming, “Build it and they will come”, only this ain’t no movie. This field of dreams is an ocean of dreams and promises. A new start for anyone who wants it. That isn’t marketable? And to top it all off, we can get funding for this project. I will go into that another time but the concept itself is investment worthy and the business that come out of it will pay the bill. Begin this project and get ready to get rich.


(Matias Volco) #4

Floating real estate is already as valuable as it is close (or inside) an already valuable real estate area such as an existing coastal city, and secondly when it is close to outstanding natural beauty. The first example corresponds to the prevalence of houseboats in the Lower Countries, and Europe, Asia and even Africa in general. The second example corresponds to the leisure houseboat on a lake, BC fjord in North America. Sausalito’s house boats might combine both examples.
A seastead would allow for houseboats to be built on a larger number, scale, and distance from the coast.
The golden area is in my opinion immediately outside the congested and contested waters of a city, but close enough to the city (or outstanding natural wonder) to be able to row a kayak comfortably in less than 4 hours (15km)

(stephen russell) #5

Hotel center
Diver training
Submersible service base
Scuba safaris?
Tourism subs for guests
Au Natural Tourism market.
Reuse idle oil rigs for SS
Sub Rescue hub
Combo Resort above & Undersea.
3D guided drones from Control center
Oil & Gas from undersea.
Aquaarcheology IE sunken loot sold on market. see Mel Fisher.
ship, boat, sub Repair dock

& Income from
tourism (dining, scuba safari, sub use)
service boats, subs, ships.
Research lab rental
TV & Movie use
X worldwide.

closed #6

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