What could someone without qualifications, skills, or expendable finances offer this project?


(Wyatt Voss) #1

As a project with the potential to remedy a significant number of modern maladies within society, surely there’s something that, say, a endearing college student could do to get in on the ground floor!


(Chad Elwartowski) #2

I think one of the big things you have over just about everyone else would be the ability to just show up.

I would venture to say that once a seastead is started, sure there will be investors, there will be people encouraging the process online, but there are very few that will be willing to pick up their lives and move half way across the planet to get the process going.

You can get a taste of how things will go from looking at the Free State Project. The state of New Hampshire was chosen over a decade ago and even though people only needed to move within their own country to another state, only about 2,000 people made the move (not to say that isn’t significant).

Give yourself a life goal to live on the first seastead, wherever it might be. Prepare yourself over the next few years to make that happen. If you are in college, then great. Finish college and figure out how you can put the knowledge you gain in school to good use on the seastead.

From what I have seen, it appears that the first seastead will likely be floating in 2019/2020. That gives you plenty of time to prepare. Just think of what you want to bring to the seastead as far as skills and hone them.

Also remember that though the first seasteaders will likely be rich (as early adopters of most new technologies tend to be), they will still need people around to do work. Consider saving up for a cheap boat that could anchor near the seastead for an easy commute to work.


#3

Research, research, research… Plenty of things in this forum and the archived old forum that can be used to our advantage.

What do YOU want to do with your life? Since you are a college student, how can you tailor your degree toward Seasteading? I have no idea what degree you are seeking, but there is nothing available that cannot be applied. THAT is the glory of a frontier… They need EVERYTHING. Find a gap and fill it.

My own take leans to family-scale independence, with a family sized seastead. I’m definitely NOT a good city-dweller. For the cost of building a home, I can build and outfit a hull. Looking for a property to build and float-out from. Admittedly, I have years and years of personal research into my decision-making process, with a number of researched avenues, but I’ve settled for 2 designs that I’ve come up with, along with what I think are viable homestead-type methods to make a more self-sufficient living, with farming at sea. The more fully thought out your plans, the easier they are to integrate into a lifestyle that is tailored to your own situation and abilities.

Personally, I see drawbacks to the entire floating condo/resort that I feel are being ignored, while I have tried to document and source every aspect of my own concepts.


(Jordan) #4

This seems to be different from previous frontiers, which typically appealed to the poor rather than the rich. Why do you think that is?


(Jordan) #5

You know, I’ve always envisioned the TSI’s method as something that has room for modular residential docking areas. Is that not the case? And even if it’s not, right now I live in an unincorporated area of a county, that’s 10 minutes from town. When I’m at home, though, it feels like I’m a million miles from nowhere. Why not seastead a few miles from “town”, reap the benefits of the special economic and political zones, and still be on your own and not annoyed by city life?


(Chad Elwartowski) #6

Their initial seastead is estimated to cost over $150 million. It will house somewhere around 300 people. This would mean that unless some charitable millionaire wants to give away money (as they all just love doing), those 300 people will have to pay for the structure. That’s around half a million dollars each person.


(Bob LLewellyn) #7

That’s not the Marinea project. They are looking at the mechanical seastead, we are looking at a community like an old western town. We supply the basics like a general store, saloon, transportation and a small hotel with restaurant. In our vision, people would just buy a used boat and drop anchor where they like. Phase two would see more permanent housing in a marina environment. A barge made from steal or cement just doesn’t cost that much, I don’t know what they are adding to make the cost that high, I already know that we can do better when the time comes.

A person without qualifications, skills or expendable finances is an unspoiled canvas ready for the big picture. You don’t have anything to unlearn before you can really begin to learn. We don’t really know what we will find when we get set up. There maybe services that we never thought of before that makes the village something special. So take my advice with a grain of salt.

Food production will be our early mainstay. Learn hydroponics, aquaponics, fish-farming, egg production aboard barges- anything that people eat will always be a good business. Besides that do whatever you like doing. The floating village will need barbers and cooks, painters and bartenders. Whatever you would do on dirt, you can do on water. You can work from the back of your boat or on the town-floats.

The Marinea idea is to start small and simple, then grow into what we want it to be. There is plenty of room for you because you have the main ingredient that you need, you want it.
Bob


(Larry G) #8

I, like Jeff and Bob, believe that seasteads will not be built and populated by rich people. If rich people and corporations build anything, it will be vacation homes and resorts. There’s a fundamental difference there, although the technological systems may have some parallel evolution.

Seasteads have to have some native industry of some kind for the residents. Resorts and vacation homes do not. The crew provides labor, but they are not permanent nor invested.

For college students- research, design, and be willing to get your hands dirty with some projects and experiments. Keep your career and finances in shape to participate in a project.


(Jordan) #9

Well, in the 1600s the cost of travel to the “new world” was also prohibitive and completely out of the realm of possibility for most would-be travelers except for through the means of indentured servitude etc.

The other thing is, I bet adjusting for inflation, the cost of travelling to the new world back then might not be AS expensive, but similarly out of reach.


#10

Add me to that list, too.

There probably will be a few speciality seasteading projects (similar to elite vacation spots or conference centers) …

… but those won’t represent “community” in the same way homesteading did on the American or Austrailian frontiers.


(Larry G) #11

I am not sure that is correct. Indentured servitude mostly served to build an investment stake to purchase tools and a stake for independent land ownership, not just for transportation. That is, in order to be a land owner, one needs capital and tools to start a farm, including livestock and seed. Most people in Europe of the day would find this out of reach financially. The travel to the new world not as much so. This is pretty similar to what I would imagine in a sea stead. Travelling to join a seastead as a laborer, not so expensive or out of reach. Creating a new seastead, or buying into a seastead… that requires capital of some kind.

In addition, there were many social and legal factors preventing emigration to the new world- many people were bound to the land, in some cases quite literally in a legal sense. They were not entirely free to make their own economic choices. And tradition was nearly as strong a bond as law. The internal mobility of citizens in a modern developed nation already lends itself very well to out-emigrating, if only there is a worthy place to go.

Having travelled a good part of the world, I have not yet found a place that I consider superior to the USA in enough aspects to justify giving up my birth nation. There is no place absolutely superior in personal freedom and security.


(Jordan) #12

What about Chile? That Galt people seem to like it.


#13

Chile has legal issues… Foreigners aren’t allowed to own property, and there is no international way to recover losses in a private venture. Basically, they see it as you giving the citizen money, regardless of your loss.


(EK) #14

Can I get in on that list too? :stuck_out_tongue:


(Jordan) #15

That’s too bad. It’s kinda like The Philippines about property ownership then.

Edit: Actually I’m pretty sure that’s not true. Not that blogs are a great source of factual information, but a basic Google search seems to indicate that foreigners can, in fact, own property in Chile. https://www.justlanded.com/english/Chile/Chile-Guide/Property/Property-in-Chile


#16

Things may have changed, but it was part of the problem with the original Galt’s Gulch attempt.


(Bob LLewellyn) #17

Lets look at some costs. A barge 195 feet long, 35’ wide and 26’ deep. The listed price $68,500. That’s 6,825 sq, feet and since most rooms are 7 to 8 feet high, we could put three floors in this one barge with a 26 ft height. We’ll make that 2 floors of living space and a large basement for septic tanks, water holding etc. We will also remove 5 feet from the width to account for passageways. 195’ long divided by 8 families is 24 feet, times a 30’ wide is 720 sq feet. We’ll double that for two floors so a family home with 1500 sq ft plus basement is what we are looking at. All the inside is constructed out of wood at a cost of materials around 15,000. Electrical generation and pumps another 5,000. Total $20K plus barge.

$20K times 8 = $160,000 plus barge of $68,500 total $228.500 Add paint, sealer and maybe a floating dock for easy boarding and lets call it an even $300,000. I’ve sold homes for more than that as a Realtor and for that we have 8 homes. Lets say we finance this at 10% Amortized over 10 years.
Monthly Payment: $3,964
Total Interest: $175,742 (No pre-payment)
Total Interest: $175,742 (As given)
SAVINGS: $0 Total Interest Saved, 0 Years shorter loan
Avg Interest each month $1,464

$3,964 / 8 families is $495.50 That’s less than I pay for rent and its for only 10 years. This is the barge that I used in my example.
https://www.oceanmarine.com/detail.cfm?195ft-Hopper-Barge---13916&product_id=13916&category_current=6&category_current_sub=28

$59,460 / 1500 sq ft is $39.64 per sq ft.
Compare a mobile home 75 X 14 = 1050 sq ft cost of $40,000 for a price per sq ft of $38.10. Pretty close. Living at sea is affordable.


Landluber's Guide to Seasteading Feasibility
(.) #18

This is the ground floor, and you are in.


(Larry G) #19

I think that is do-able. Only make sure you’re using a realistic estimate of what is necessary for long-term accommodations. There are safety and comfort standards for accommodation barges that you can easily reference. I’ve posted them somewhere here on the forum before.

If you can further design a means for people to earn a living, you can create a co-op business model for maintaining the facility too.


(.) #20

"All the inside is constructed out of wood ."
That is interesting, I like that.
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.
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“If you can further design a means for people to earn a living, you can create a co-op business model for maintaining the facility too.”

At that point, I think, it would work.