Using AI to come up with a better system of governance?


(Chad Elwartowski) #1

I agree that there should be separate areas for each. I support the more decentralized system as possible. That way you have a choice. Which seasteading brings to the table.

I am not against a constitution or basic rules to follow, you should expect to know what you’re getting into when you arrive and should be more than able to leave if that changes. If you go into a restaurant, you pretty much know the unwritten rule that you will sit down and eat first then pay afterwards. You go into a grocery store and you pick up your food and pay before you leave. You go to a street vendor and you pay before you eat. These all have rules and it is not something an anarcho capitalist would cry about. The key being that if you’re eating and they change the rules and make you pay up front for your meal, you can choose to get up and walk out. If you choose to go to the “soup Nazi” and he spews racial epitaphs at you, you knew what you were getting into and can come back or not if you wish.

The US has a flawed constitution and people who are born here are expected to follow it without having much choice until you’re old enough and able enough to leave. (I say that the US constitution is flawed not because what was written was wrong if was followed and that we have such shitty laws because the constitution wasn’t followed, but if the constitution was so good…it wouldn’t be able to reach the point where it’s not followed anymore).

This is why I see more of a “club with dues” approach. If you’re getting what you paid for then you will pay year by year. If one year they say “Education is now going to include teaching kids that the world is flat…and health care? You have to set your own broken bones.”…then when the beginning of the year comes around and you get to choose to be a citizen for another year you can opt out.

The whole concept of seasteading makes most of this moot. If your system sucks, it will fail and nobody will live on your seastead. If it is good, people will continue to live there and be happy.

I have been looking into AI lately and it seems like what we are doing with seasteads, people are using AI to find the best of many different things. You run something through a program and let it try different things millions of times as it learns which solution is the best and it can improve on existing processes.

I would actually love to see an AI program try to come up with the best model for governance. It would require a lot of input and would never be perfect because human behavior is hard to model but it might give a better solution than what anyone else could think of.

I would also warn against putting too much time into thinking up your future nation’s next constitution. As they say, opinions are like assholes…and all of that. Seasteading tends to bring a lot of future kings in search of their kingdoms to rule. Your ideas will be one of many. The high likelihood will be that each new platform created will be crowdfunded around some proposed governance and use solution. Whoever puts it together will have to convince enough people to put millions of dollars into their proposed solution for that seastead.

We will see though. I look forward to actually living on a seastead and coming up with these ideas among people you know could actually be living in your new government.


Introduction- Productivism and Constitutional Capitalism
(Wilfried Ellmer) #2

sure it may well find that the best model of governance is to erradicate the human factor from the planet and deplete the atmosphere of oxigen to make electronic circuits last longer…:grinning:


Introduction- Productivism and Constitutional Capitalism
(Chad Elwartowski) #3

Yes, I know. Hollywood has done it’s job on making people fear future technology including AI.

But it is just like a computer program (I remember when computers were supposed to cause WWIII in the movies).

We use AI every day when we’re using a GPS to find the optimum route to drive. Sure they’re off sometimes but the fact that they work at least 90% of the time is probably more accurate than most people giving directions. Or just trying to find your way on your own.

Current AI is limited and the stuff I looked into was more of a way to identify images, which have become quite advanced. But it’s all a computer. Intelligence is knowing something. Artificial Intelligence is just a computer knowing something. In some cases it is the knowledge of the closest McDonalds and other cases it is being able to identify a car from a person.


(Wilfried Ellmer) #4

Actually asking “what is the best government” is like asking “what is the best color” ?

It depends entirely on the viewpoint and taste of the person who asks.

Having heated discussions on such matter is simply pointless and timewaste …

… an AI may add a “very particular viewpoint” to this pointless discussion if you ask it…

…so good luck with that - and stage your experiment in a way that it does not involve the whole planet please…


The correct question would be - “what is the best sistem that allows negotiation and integration of all different human viewpoints and experiences in a just and equilibrated way” - blockchain voting- may be the best answer we have for now…(politics as we know it should go down the drain very fast very soon…)


I vote against putting AI in charge of human future...for good reasons ( that have nothing to do with fearmongering - it is a question of viewpoint - i would like to see humans to stay the predominant lifeform who is in charge - and i am against "being nannied" by anyone...)...

context: (google up)

• subdue to nobody
• enlightenment ideas - do we need kings and government
• there must always be a government - wrong -
• seasteading is about escape politics in all its forms


(Chad Elwartowski) #5

There is a huge leap between letting AI run government and running several criteria through a program millions of time to see if there are any outcomes that make sense.

You might want to find out what is the most balanced form of government, president with house and senate and judicial branch? How many people in each branch? What powers does each hold?

Run it through something with multiple criteria millions of times to see what comes out. Maybe it creates multiple leaders, maybe it spreads the power out in a way we hadn’t thought of before.

Then we have a roadmap to put humans into power under such a structure. For a single seastead (not the whole globe) this might make for an interesting experiment.

Not…“hey guys, let’s give Siri control over the nuclear codes and see if she can sort out humans.”


(Wilfried Ellmer) #6

@Elwar | Chad, I assume that we should talk about that sipping a Margarita in Cafe del Mar