Reviewing DeltaSync’s construction estimates on the simple square Concrete Caissons


(Matias Volco) #45

@Octavian
That’s what I thought! And not only at sea is premium space used and valued. Some city centers can be 3, 5 or more stories undergroud. I mean in sailboats the lowest part of the hull is dedicated to machinery, storage, and actually in many cases the motor is at around cabin level. Cabins, whether above or below the waterline, are partially submerged at almost all times while sailing. But their small size and materials makes them too hot in tropical latitudes.
I contend that in the floating city living space can easily be located under the waterline.
The “canyon” or promenade of Oasis of the Seas is several stories higher (or deep) than the total height of the projected 50m platform. Some sunlight could easily reach directly or/and be refracted to even the lowest level of the caisson.


(Wilfried Ellmer) #46

oasis of the seas (like all cruise ships) is built as “integrated honeycomb shell structure” not as “house on a platform”…it is a “concept that looks inside” to a central (protected and designed) space like a shopping mall or a stadion. Not a “family house suburban concept taken to the water” with the sky and draupner waves all over it.


#47

@ellmer & Matias

That is exactly what I’m talking about! Hopefully, the Design Contest could lead to a change in concept.

Also, I was wondering about the projected “breakwater”,…Is that a floating one or is it fixed on the seabed all around the Floating City? Is that really necessary for the current Baystead format?


(Wilfried Ellmer) #48

octavian, your coral reefstead has this construction prinicple incorportated too. I asume this comes from your practical experience with the marine ambient. This kind of understanding of the basic prinicples make a great seasteading project developer. Reefstead is a great example how to implement that in a relativly small structure and give it the capacity to stand against quite big waves with a bow structure.


(Wilfried Ellmer) #49

octavian, your coral reefstead has this construction prinicple incorportated too. I asume this comes from your practical experience with the marine ambient.


#50

@ellmer

Yes, it does and that practical experience came in handy.

US Navy newest Zumwalt class destroyer bow design also helped :wink:

Aside from that, the design has address and solved most of the seasteading requirements:

  • Stability is very high. 1.86 LOA to BEAM ratio, equivalent to a catamaran design ratio, therefore low rolling angles, and due to the wave piercing bow, low pitching angles no matter if mobile or stationary.
  • Mobile vs Stationary epic question solved. It’s a hybrid that will cruise economically @ 10 knt or can spend years at anchor retaining mobility (just in case)
  • Scalable and modular. Can be built 100 ft or 1000 m LOA. The structure is equilateral (all its sides are the same length), therefore highly modular. In fact, such modules can be rafted up to infinite combinations.

FLOATING MARINA

NEW VENICE :smile:

  • Design Enhanced Artificial Climate Marine Habitat. I know, it’s long,… :slight_smile: It simply means that it can blow 20 knots with 10 feet waves out there but on the protected lagoon side it will feel like a light breeze with 2 feet wavelets.

  • Design Protected Docking Facilities. Depending on its size, the structure can accommodate from mega yachts, to sailboats, small pleasure boats, commercial vessels, etc. on well protected docks that will facilitate ease of doing business aboard through fast and efficient exchange of cargo and passengers.


Octavian's Reefstead
#51

Awesome Design Concept, I am liking this very much, Perfect for the Open Ocean, accommodations for Seafaring Yachts! Build it and they will come!

Have You shown this to any interested parties yet? This is what gets people with money excited enough to spend it, cool well thought out Design Concepts that solve the issues of being out on the open Ocean in a way that is simply irresistible!


(Wilfried Ellmer) #52

The wave piercing bow is known as "ulstein bow" it reduces the sag stress in the structure when going trough a big wave.

A floating island with a wave piercing bow feature can also be pictured like this…

More pictures: here


(.) #53

What is the price of concrete? I saw 77 USD per cubic meter. Is that about correct?
And with a specific gravity of 2.5 g per cubic cm = 2.5 kg per cubic decimeter,
a cubic meter being 1000 cubic decimeter, so the 1 m3 would be 2500 kg or 2.5 metric tons.


(Matias Volco) #54

Hey @octavian that design of yours is pretty cool as it takes into account the underwater outdoor area. :slight_smile:
I had something similar (not the bow though) specifically in mind for the breakwater which I imagined to float and to be useful/desirable as real estate space

@Ellmer, I imagine a “concrete beach” would have the opposite effect? Would it make the wave bigger until it crashes or is dispersed on the other(inner) side?


#55

Ty Darian.

No, I didn’t start marketing it yet. It is still a work in progress based on fundamentals since I am spending only part time at it. As I was mentioning to ellmer, the size of it will require a team effort to move it from “cool concept” to “under development” stage.


(Bob LLewellyn) #56

I have a question, the new cement and designs are really interesting but why something that is heavier than water? I would think that there would be other, lighter than water materials that could be used. It is said that plastic takes over 5000 years to break down in a landfill, would it break down all that much faster in saltwater?

I would think layering something semi ridged like a sheet of plastic then a polymer like Styrofoam, creating maybe about 4 layers. It seams to me as though that would be a strong as needed while still being lighter than water. Those two substances maybe unacceptable in saltwater but is there nothing that is?
Bob


(Wilfried Ellmer) #57

the baseline on “how to” of construction materials is the concrete canoe competition - even a first semester engineerng student can produce concrete that floats and create a canoe that still floats when full of water…you build a composite material like cement based composits to the properties you desire see more about it here


#58

Octavian; you have clearly evaluated the need to consider the design for the best use of available space on any given Ocean or Bay Platform and it appears we are all finding some welcome agreement on this point. I love it when a group of enthusiast who are passionate and have many ideas about the subject at hand can cooperatively identify the important challenges, seek solutions and arrive at a certain level of consensus for a common cause or project. The open sharing that leads to a deeper understanding of what is wanted and needed at every level of the project within the group as a whole makes it become much more real and attainable!

I also watched the video which provided an excellent ‘Design Model Reference,’ that shows what actually is working already in the Cruise Industry. I think it is smart to take advantage of what is known to be the most efficient use of space and distribution of weight for stability. When the video finished, some related YouTube choices were displayed and I watched this one about Future Cruising, this Ship is scheduled to be built between now and 2020 and I really really love the concept and comprehensive Deep Green Technology. I find it very inspirational!


To which point the Cruise Ship industry can be a design reference for Seasteading
#59

Yes a ‘Team Effort’ will indeed be required along with financing and a Company legal entity by which to operate as a functional unit. I see allot of talent, knowledge and passion here that has real potential, I think there may come a point where it will make sense to start discussing the possibility of organizing a Cooperative Collaboration Company and make a run at a Crowd Fund Campaign. I have several ideas about how to raise revenue for this endeavor that I would like to share with you all as we continue to get to know each other.


#60

As I said to Octavian, I am loving all this wonderful consensus happening here, this is how Cooperative Collaboration between people who are passionate about something begins and grows and self organizes like a Bee Hive. It’s Nature at Work!


#61

Your knowledge on this subject is deep and broad and I want to learn everything you have to Share here even though getting up to speed will take a considerable amount of research. It is awesome the way you always provide links to the knowledge of which You speak. Your like a SeaStead Wiki and I mean that in the most kindest sense possible. You Really Rock It Ellmer! Thank You for all the positive input and dedication You provide here, You keep this site and the discussions upbeat and humming along.


#62

That’s quite a design!! X bow, sailing trimaran hull cruise ship concept! Excellent find Darian.

I totally agree with you that “there may come a point in time where it will make sense to start discussing the possibility of organizing a Cooperative Collaboration Company and make a run at a Crowd Fund Campaign”.

In fact, I firmly believe that point is NOW and I like your idea of a Cooperative Collaboration Company. So if you are ready, lets talk.


FLORIDA - Cooperative Collaboration Company - Crowd Funding Campaign
#63

I like your Enthusiasm Octavian! There are a few different possibilities I have been working on (I have many Interests) and am still weighing the issues for whether to go bigger or smaller on the first Crowd Funding Campaign.

I attended a local Hacker/Maker MeetUp over in Rocklin last Thursday where three locals who did very well on their respective campaigns told their stories about the challenges and successes and for each of them it all just seems to have grown out of their passion and commitment to their respective endeavors. One of them raised $870,000 for his 3d Printer Project.

In my view this Endeavor is about how to make a Good Living out on the Open Ocean, so this will be an important focus for the Campaign that will grab the interest of Our Supporters and Participants. There is much to talk about and I am thrilled that You are so interested in working with me on this Cooperative Collaboration Project.

For now consider whether making a documentary about this project would be a plan You would be willing to participate in. By the Way where are you located, are you in California?

I have some things to take care of again Tomorrow but I will check in as soon as I get a chance and share some more about what I have been considering and also to get Your feedback. Thanks for Your positive input Octavian, it is very much appreciated. Positive things happen when people get together and decide to make them happen!


#64

I am located in West Palm Beach Florida area.

My opinion is that we should start by clearly defining the following:

WHY?

WHAT?

WHERE?

WHEN?

HOW?