Creating structures with onsite materials without cement?

(Stevan White) #1

Hello first off I used to post to this forum as Ztevan Whyte but have been unable to get back into my account so will be using this one instead.

The problem with using cement is that it is very costly and in time it cracks and crumbles. The higher quality cement costs a lot more and for such a large project as you aspire it would be a logistical nightmare and the cost would be insane.

I do not have a stake in this project and couldn’t afford to be a part of it but I love the concept and would like to help if I can so here is my suggestion.

Whether you are building a submerged sea wall or barrier or a floating platform I think it may be possible to use sand to make glass to do so. You could make the glass sponge like and filled with pockets of air so it may be able to float or you can make it slab like for submerged sea walls. This sounds impractical but let me explain more how to do this onsite:

Use Mobile and modular glass induction forges. If you have a way to generate electricity such as solar, wind etc then this is possible it’s just a matter of scaling the power to meet the needs. If you are going to have a sea island you would need this amount of power anyways for the residents to use.

With induction forges you can melt a lot of different metals and maybe quartz or silica as well. You could always add iron flakes to the sand mixture and that may help to get the rest of sand to heat up and melt if it doesn’t do so on its own.

In this way the limiting factors are just the amount of power you have. Speed of production is limited to power as well.

I hope this idea helps.

(Wilfried Ellmer) #2

| construction in the 21st century | concrete sea structures |

sure interesting idea - do you have data - test pieces in the 200 tons of material range - something that goes a bit beyond "idea"...and "experiment that fits on a kitchen table"...because you need to IMPLEMENT this in "building size"...what is the difficult is for a reason that cement is mankinds most used construction material...and the reason is, you can handle tons of it - relativly easy and economic...the easyness and economics in building sized application is what you have to compete with.. can you do that ?

Glass fibers are used as fiber component in advanced resin or cement bonded composite materials already. It is one of the hundreds of useful materials on the list our group is investigating.

It is not about using one material or the other - it is about using them all in convenient combinations to facilitate the rise of New-Atlantis and New-Venice...

(Stevan White) #3

Hi and thanks for your reply. I literally have dozens of ideas; some I share with everyone, some I share with certain people and some ideas I don’t share at all. This is an idea I share with your cause.

I would love to test such an idea but lack the ways and means. The effectiveness or usability of this idea is an unknown entity but logically speaking I believed it held enough merit to share with your group.

(.) #4

It seems to be reasonable to me. I would think, that cement and sand melting could be used
at the same time, for example to make blocks and build them into structures using concrete.

Logistics are important. Developing hands on, know-how is also important.

Cheers, and best regards;

(.) #5

Stevan White; thank you for your post.

Thinking more about it, silica, and glass fiber is part of modern concrete (probably).
And fiberglass resin hulls do contain glass.

I have been thinking about developing a small solar panel array in my backyard to test
energy generation methods. I think, the logistics of the photo-voltaic system is a bit better
than solar ray concentrating methods. Mirrors have to be focused on the target.
An electric connection puts flexibility between the capture of the energy and the using point
of that electricity. A photo-voltaic energy capture coupled with an induction oven could work.

It might require an initial investment of money and time, as anything else does.

(Stevan White) #6

I agree with you and Ellmer such concepts need to be thoroughly tested before implementing. I could see a list of pros and cons for both really.

As far as glass induction goes you could make induction coil into a form so you could make prefab sections onsite that you would just connect together. For instance you can make prefab glass foam slabs that are 8’ x 8’ and 1 foot depth. This is arbitrary but to give an idea of the process.

Concrete takes up to a month to fully cure while glass can be quenched and is ready to use. Glass is really hard which is good but you would need a smooth surface on all sides because a crack would form under less than max stress if not done right.

I initially had this idea for a new building technique on land but thought it would be great for your project as well.

What would be amazing is to make silicon carbide platforms with the induction forge. The hardness of silicon carbide is 9-9.5 mohs to put into perspective diamonds are 10 mohs.

(.) #7

I have a few projects in mind.
It appears that the ring weave technique of using waste car tires is an interesting one.
The unusual part or the car tire project is the payment of removing the tires from
waste tire generators.

It gives a strange perceptional change of the ownership of the structure that is built.
If someone destroys, confiscates, steals the structure, another structure can be built
for more money. and the money is upfront.

So what would be the value of the structure? Well, it is interesting.

(Stevan White) #8

At first thought tires seem like an excellent idea besides the fact they would leach radon into the ocean and other chemicals. It would have to be encapsulated perhaps with concrete? :stuck_out_tongue:

Edit: my brain crossed over and confused with tires with the properties of granite… adhd is fun isn’t it?

(.) #9

If it leaches radon into the ocean, would it not leach radon on the road?
So no radon. That is a nuclear power plant not a car tire.
Other chemicals are the same.

That is a strange idea.

(.) #10

Car tires are all around us. They are on cars. These tires are used, some new.
Even US Coastguard uses car tires, on their cars and trucks.

And car tires go in water. It rains. That is freshwater, whatever it is, it is probably more
soluble in freshwater than in saltwater.

And tires are used up on the road. So particles come off the tires, and those particles stay on the road.

It is strange to think about it. What is the sum of total weight per year of those particles, that
get worn off the tires? Well, US 250 million tires per year wear away. Where is the radon?

(Stevan White) #11

Tires seem very plausible maybe it should be encapsulated because they still leach off some chemicals like sulfur to start with.

Sorry I confused tires with leaching of radon I typed the word ‘encapsulated’ and for some reason thought radon. I think it was because of a theory I read about concerning the pyramids of Egypt. They were made predominantly of granite but encapsulated with limestone. The granite ionized the air in the chambers of the pyramid whilst the limestone served as a insulator. On the top of the pyramids there used to be a gold cap from which the Egyptians brought down lightning from the sky. It was the wardenclyff tower thousands of years before Tesla.

Anyways my brain hurts now good luck with the seastead whichever materials you decide to use. I may drop in from time to time if that’s okay.

(Chad Elwartowski) #12

Glass has been brought up before as a building material and is certainly viable. The key characteristic with glass that was brought up was its compressive strength (I may be getting the word wrong). The idea being that two glass bottles bumping into each other will snap back into their rigidity after each hit quickly and thus not degrade over time. While two concrete blocks bumping against each other will degrade.

Of course you have to overcome glass’s weak tensile strength. You can hit concrete with a hammer and not much happens, you hit glass with a hammer and it shatters. Though pinging glass for 100 years will not break it while pinging concrete for 100 years will destroy it.

I have considered the thought that we would be building in the ocean and it is best to use materials on hand to build. My initial thought (after visiting a salt mine that had these huge salt crystals) was to check to see if we could somehow use salt crystals shaped into bricks or something, knowing that salt water degrades everything over time…why not fight that with salt itself? A quick check on the properties of salt revealed that salt (even large crystals) dissolves in water.

But glass is fine against salt water. I wonder if glass bottom boats are actually made of glass, or if that is some other material.

(Chad Elwartowski) #13

On the old forum there was a guy who was experimenting with glass wine bottles. He took all of his wine bottles and turned them upside down then strapped them together into cubes. The material he used to bind them would corrode over time but he was trying to use it as a way to grow mangroves. The idea being that the mangroves would take over the binding and wrap around the bottles keeping them floating.

I’m not sure what happened with his experiment. Perhaps in the name of science he drank too much wine and went down a darker path than one of scientific discovery.

(.) #14

No sulfur

Tire crumbs are used for playground covering for children, and mixed in road covering
for roads. Waste tires leak no sulfur…

(.) #15

Steven White; (could say Mr. White), -)))
Write some more.
Till next time;
Best regards;

(Stevan White) #16

Here is my current idea I thought of moments ago:

Got to love adhd lol

(.) #17

I thought about getting one of those electric furnace things, and melting glass bottles into
a glass brick.

(Chad Elwartowski) #18

Maybe this would work.

(.) #19

I cannot access videos at this time. May be, 4 more hours.

Glass has a high melting point, so metal foundry might not be enough,
but, it might work. I cannot tell right now. I think glass melts somewhere
at 1200 deg Cels.

(.) #20

The melting point of glass is 1723 degrees Celsius or 3133.4 degrees Fahrenheit