Building Barges Using Advanced Concrete Methods?

(noboxes) #125

I’m sorry, but he did not offer me any money to be that interested in his business.

It looks like there’s a history on TSI of Ellmer asking for money for proof of anything he has done. In this thread, he offered me words, i offered him words. I did not ask for his data, i asked only for pictures. At this point, we are even. Imagine any other company making a pitch to convince buyers to give them money, and showing no pictures of the product for sale, and showing no pictures of it in use. Most advertising offers data for free, like the car’s mpg, the shed’s square footage, the air conditioner’s btu, the appearance of the cheeseburger, the application of house paint. My belief at this moment is Mr. Ellmer has not performed the testing he claimed he has done.

(Larry G) #127

I have samples of the basalt meshes that Nick sells. they are very interesting, but I have not yet performed significant experiments with them. I am planning to build a small hull in the next year or so, but I have to work out the space for it first.

(Nick Gencarelle) #128

I have people who sell geo-polymers but the Cor-Tuf is a superior option.


That will all depend on application, though.

Geopolymer should last far longer, be more resistant to biofouling, have higher water impermeability, higher chemical resistance, as well as being easier to patch, bonding and returning to original strength. W/O Ordinary Portland Cement, Geopolymer has lower CO2 emissions associated with the manufacture, as well.

Not really an apples/oranges comparison, though. More an apples to pears… Similar in most aspects, even applications, but a few differences that I would say boil down to preferences.

(noboxes) #130

Links, please?? ?? ?? ?? <-- because post must be at least 20 chars.

(Wilfried Ellmer) #131


Nick can you please give us some info why you consider a special cement bonded composite superior to what you have tested on geo-polymer bonded composites … from a practical point of view.
You must be one of the view here who can have a “educated opinion” on that topic especially on the topic of compare…

(Nick Gencarelle) #132

Geo-polymers are great cements and range typically in the 10-12,000 psi range with fantastic chemistry that does not allow for acids and aggressive chemical penetrations. Used mostly now in the oil gas field.
UHPC is easily twice the strength in compression and flexural modulus of elasticity and I have new secret additives that significantly boost tensile strengths.
21-30,000 plus psi.

(Nick Gencarelle) #133

The impact properties of our UHPC means to me that a floating structure can take a much bigger hit than other cements. It can be quickly repaired and bonded in accidents to mitigate damage. Very impermeable.
A thinner lighter final solution when combined with basalt reinforcements. Still very dense and heavy but as one might say pour three inches instead of ten as in a regular Portland mix with steel the cost then become equal to or better for a much longer lasting product. Longevity has been the bane of ferrocement and they were way too heavy for practical boat speeds.

(noboxes) #134

A shining example of people having the information and not sharing. For those who want to build, or at least test using a geopoly, we build nothing. I ran into the exact same situation with EPDM, i have never met a professional roofer who would admit to knowing of it, let alone sell it to me. The only worse situation is those jacking up the prices until items are unaffordable, so they can pay their investors.

(Nick Gencarelle) #135

What are you talking about-did you read the above?

(noboxes) #136

Yes, you “have people” who sell it, but it’s not on your webpages as an item for sale. I even asked for links here in this thread. So do not know who has it for sale.

(Nick Gencarelle) #137

Call me I will get you the product. I am in business.

(Nick Gencarelle) #138

401-481-8422 or


@NickGri. The Geopolymer firm, here in Texas, has been rather short on communication, regarding in depth information, prices and availability. Presumably, this is due to the lack of commercial credentials on the part of those of us most interested, even regardless of things such as my own intent to manufacture preformed portions of projects intended for commercialization.

Some of us would like to be able to order smaller quantities to experiment with, while developing those ideas, as well as needing more information on properties, such as Geopolymer bonding to existing, precast Geopolymer, as well as mould release agents, among other things.

Disappointingly difficult to make any progress, even for those trying to get commercial viability, without access to adequate information and supplies.

With better cooperation, instead of the close ranked, ‘insiders only’ barriers we face, it could open up the field to a wide spectrum of projects.

For my own part, I am recently certified in the teaching and construction of a particular Biogas Digester, using steel forms for cast in-situ work. My intended modifications and improvements require that Geopolymer or Concrete be able to bond permanently to such precast parts, as well as the potential for embedded tubing for heating them, along with added external permanent insulating layers and certain pieces needing to be strong, yet light weight.

Despite attempted email communication, there has been inadequate or nonexistent responses and insufficient information.

(Kerim Tapkan) #140

Hi Richard,

SR 520 floating bridge in Washington State has been constructed using same methodology. Yes they can have 100 years of lifespan if correct concrete mix is used. Of course the structural design differs from barges for long structures like this. embedding pre and post tension cables into the concrete are required to withstand the moments and hydrodynamic forces.

It consists of 77 concrete pontoons, largest at 360 ft long.

You can see the key facts of the project here:

I have a very detailed powerpoint presentation regarding the design and construction methods of the SR 520. I can send on demand.


(Nick Gencarelle) #141

Yes, as Geo-polymer is relatively new, many companies are being protective of their mix designs. IP is easily stolen these days and no one wants to give a little bit to have others re-engineer product and not buy from them. Yes, these bond incredibly well to steel and woods, but not plastics-we use plastics as forms for a nice smooth finish. If you have a large enough project and are willing to pay the price for advanced cements they will supply that. As I said, they are so busy now doing oil gas companies and fracking materials that they have no need for small development project ideas. I on the other hand, can supply what I have said is an even better solution available today. We are developing a foam version of the UHPC now so when that is available we will announce it. Other foams are already available-put the basalt mesh and fibers and rebar in that to bring it up in strength. Everyone can not complain about product not being available and not call me to purchase some.

(Larry G) #142

It’s difficult to get new materials types as a person without extensive industry vendor relationships. I found this to be the case when I first started my firearms dealership as well. It took years to find the best suppliers and pricing.

A representative email is copied below:


Sorry for my late reply, as I was traveling.

At this time we are not pursuing any additional licensed partners. It is a matter of investment and scale, as well as territory/exclusivity rights that have been granted to protect the overall integrity of the brand. We only sell product for its intended use to these contractors.

I appreciate the interest, but this is not something we could supply.

Best regards,

John Hepfinger
Global Market Manager
Milliken Infrastructure Solutions, LLC
1300 Brownwood Avenue
LaGrange, GA 30240 USA
T 706.880.5054 / C 706.302.4476

From: Larry Good
Sent: Friday, August 04, 2017 4:12 PM
To: John Hepfinger
Subject: Re: Milliken Product Inquiry

Thank you for the reply, John.

What does it take to become a licensed partner?

Really, I’m interested in small-scale experimentation with constructing specialized structures and sculpting with geopolymer and basalt fabric. I am looking for a supplier so that I don’t have to experiment with mixing my own. If a person needed a pallet or two of Geospray 61, there’s no way to order it without being a licensed contractor? Is it just a matter of scale?

On Fri, Aug 4, 2017 at 7:26 AM, John Hepfinger wrote:
Good morning Larry,

Thank you for your inquiry.

We do not offer our Geopolymer mortars for home use as they are only used in commercial infrastructure applications with our licensed contractor partners.

While there are numerous applications that many people consider when thinking about Concrete Cloth material, we believe that the most appropriate are ditch lining, slope protection, berms, and other areas with soil erosion issues. It is available through ACF West in your region.
We only use a specialty cement in Concrete Cloth that is not OPC based.

Thanks again, and we appreciate the interest in our products.

Best regards,

John Hepfinger
Global Market Manager
Milliken Infrastructure Solutions, LLC
1300 Brownwood Avenue
LaGrange, GA 30240 USA
T 706.880.5054 / C 706.302.4476

Lead Details

Created on Date: 8/3/2017 5:26 PM
Source Campaign: Milliken Infrastructure Website Contact Form
Topic: Geopolymer Mortar Systems
Account: Self
Contact: Lawrence Good
Vancouver, Washington
United States

Lead Description:
Where can I purchase materials (geopolymer mixes and concrete cloth) for small projects (home improvement for my home and rentals)? Do you have a geopoly cloth option or is it strictly OPC?

Lead Link:

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Thank you

(Larry G) #143

@Kerim_Tapkan , that would be something useful to have on


However, I’m specifically trying to buy, to build with, and a lack of cooperation by a supplier also indicates that that company is not competitive in the field.

Can you provide a source for Geopolymer, that will actually SELL Geopolymer?

(Nick Gencarelle) #145

Yes, but as I said no geo-polymer producer wants to simply send a bucket for someone else to re-engineer and basically steal the years of work they have invested to make their product. It will take an investment and NDA-etc. and a real project usually hires that developer to produce material for the project(s).
I have the people who are the leading experts in this product.